Addition to the rules

[CoffeeStain]

After having a difficult experience with a troll who had shown clear intention to troll, I was faced with a difficult decision do I allow the person to troll and wait for them to break a rules that is listed or just end it and talk to the senior admins later. So I have written a suggestion to fill this gap in the rules.



Rule 6: Admin Discretion  due to repeated acts of trolling not listed above


· When a player has shown clear intent to troll, admins will be allowed discretion to punish the offender in a logical manner.

[Bethrezen]

What exactly does "clear intention to troll" mean?

[smov]

I don't know if I have a say in this, but I ll just throw my opinion here:

I don't agree with people getting punished on a "what if" condition. If someone keeps trolling, then admins have the obligation to act upon a rulebreak, or if players feel annoyed by such behavior, they should report it in these forums as the link is literally stated in the gamerules.

One should only be banned permanently in these kinds of situations, if the higher ups all agree with it upon a rulebreak report or issued ban and inform such person of their decision and the why's via Forums or something so that person can either contest/explain or appeal his side afterwards.

[CoffeeStain]

From my point of view clear intent means continuing to troll after being warned or saying I want to get banned while trolling or something of that sort  but I decided to make this suggestion due to the fact that we have had to deal with players that are clearly trolling but since that type of trolling is not written in the rules it can be hard to enforce.

Smov, I agree that is why I am writing this because as an NA admin when I message the senior admin team for permission to deal with an unlisted situation it can take hours so this rule will help of fill to our obligation of getting rid of the rule breaker as you said.  I also agree in an ideal world people would report most trolling but sadly that almost never happens and no matter the type of ban the senior admins will look over it to make sure it is a good ban.

[smov]

I know that feeling but there are alternatives.

My suggestion is: If you believe what he is doing is a potential "rulebreak" from his part, inform the respective heads so they can decide whether or not it should be listed as a rulebreak and in positive case, add it to the rules.

Sometimes, a logical decision must be made as it is literally impossible to list all rulebreaks and I agree with admins dealing with these kinds of situations using proportional methods of punishment depending on a situation. However, should this happen, the admin should be held responsable for his actions so therefore I would only recommend admins that are experienced to act during these circunstances.

That way, I guarantee that the a player persists on doing the same, you may punish him using a rule as a resource.

[CoffeeStain]

Like I said informing the head admins and getting a response back can take hours so this would help admins do their job just look at Minisieges trolling rules they are broad so that admins can take care of trolling quickly with little disturbance to the community. Not to mention all bans are looked over by senior admins very closely so if it was a bad ban it will be dealt with properly. I am writing this rule suggestion from personal experience.

[Bethrezen]

Let's not get things confusing. On Minisiege it's not allowed to ban someone who just states his intention to troll, or who just writes "I want a ban", unless he actually breaks the rules in any way. If you've ever done that or if you've seen any admins doing that, you and anyone else should report to senior admins+.

[CoffeeStain]

That is not what I meant  I was talking about the broad definition of trolling as you could never write all forms down. Im aware that minisiege does not ban solely off chat is if something got lost in translation I apologize.
 
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[Rapez]

Trolling on EUC is a bit different from what I've seen on Minisiege so far. As you guys already said, it is not possible to define every single situation in a ruleset to provide a "troll-free" server. As an example, one of the main problems regarding trolls on EUC (which is not covered by any rule yet) is imo that players interfere with their own team by sitting at the spawn and killing nobody round after round (not being afk) until they're the last ones alive. Nevertheless, it's not possible for us to put those situations in a specific rule, but we can try to phrase it as transparent as possible giving examples for trolling and a clear instruction for admins. 
Therefore I'd suggest something similar to CoffeStains proposal adding the following aspects:

1. Any action (intentionally?) impeding the gameplay of other players or the team itself is considered as trolling (e.g. offensive language, delaying, may also include blocking arty, kicking/punching/trying to kill players or bots etc.).

2. How do admins deal with trolls? I think our regular "procedure" is fine for that. First of all the player has to be warned, then slain, kicked and eventually banned. Most of the times a warning or a slay is enough to get players back on the track. I don't think there will be a massive amount of players being perm banned for trolling on EUC, but a new rule would help us to act faster and to improve the gameplay quality for everyone. A perm ban is a last resort if the player continues to troll or has accumulated a "long history" of other punishments or rulebreaks.

[Diamond63]

Exactly what Rapez had said. Trolling on EUC is different than on MS. We simply can't define any possible troll situation, since the list would be extremely long, and no one wants to read long rules. That's why we're probably having a meeting this weekend, to try to find a compromise and at least add more troll stuff in admin guidelines.

As for dealing with them, yes, always follow the warn/slay/kick/temp/perm rule, it has worked so far, so no need to change it. However, if you see that someone is, for instance trolling arty by standing in front of the cannon without bots, feel free to slay, then warn him not to do that.

Thanks for suggestions everyone, we'll update you about this after the meeting.